Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

  • Lammergeier
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Lammergeier replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

I hear you, man. I hate man-made hybrids but I find the science behind why some species can naturally hybridise but not others pretty fascinating.

When I got Ganbie I asked the owner about trimacs. They laughed at me and said "good luck".

I think I remember you saying that about the ACA before. Depressing, really.
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  • Darth Nandopsis
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Darth Nandopsis replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

I read a few articles online about the ACA was having a convention, & was going to allow some hybrid club to have a table or something to that effect....until the backlash they got against that was so great, they "un-invited" them. I know Ed Hall is high up the ladder in the Ohio chapter, & they don't allow hybrids....good for them for taking a stance.

I was going to join the Bucks County AS, (local around me) but they are heavy SW folks, & I'm pretty sure they do the FH thing too.....so, nope, not getting my $$$$. Plus, it's every 2nd Thursday they meet, & I take my son to cross-fit training/hitting/pitching lessons all week long, so that's out.

THOSE WHO REFUSE KNOWLEDGE ARE DOOMED TO FAIL.

WATER CHANGES ARE THE LIFEBLOOD OF THIS HOBBY. IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE SO OR SIMPLY DON'T FEEL LIKE DOING THEM, RE-HOME YOUR FISH, SELL YOUR AQUARIUM & FIND ANOTHER HOBBY, AS YOU WILL FAIL UTTERLY, COMPLETELY, & MISERABLY.
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  • Lammergeier
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Lammergeier replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

You made me curious so I looked into the Victorian Cichlid Society's stance on hybrids and found this as the response:

"Some people find them attractive and if they were a true species I dare say they would be considered attractive to most, maybe even African lovers.
However they are not a true species and as the Society has a policy of "NO" Hybrids they will never be allowed in Society activities.
Of course if you decide that you want to keep them that is entirely up to you.

John."

The ACA is so well known though that I'm confident that if they do take the position of allowing hybrid species, it will only be a matter of time before it trickles down (aside from a few people taking a stance like Ed).
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Darth Nandopsis replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

This is my take on what the ACA did.......they were trying to cash in on the potential $$$$ to be made from the popularity of these things......FH's, BP's & the like.....but when word spread amongst the "old guard", as it were ( of which I definitely include myself), they shot it down real quick. It SHOULD have been shot down from the get-go......the mission of the ACA should be to preserve & protect known cichlid species, not encourage the propagation of man-made abominations.

I got into an argument with some blow-hard @ one of my local LFS haunts........& shut him down REAL quick.....his argument was that color variants of Discus, Angels & Sevs shouldn't be allowed if you don't allow FH's/BP's etc, as they are hybrids......I asked him if he knew what the definition of a hybrid was.....couldn't answer me....I informed him that hybrids are the mixing of 2 or more different species, & that all color variants are simply line-bred from different Discus for color, finnage, size,etc...& genetically they are still Discus/Angels/Sevs. If you buy a Cobalt Discus, it's simply a Discus w/ a dominant gene for the Cobalt color.......when you buy a FH or a BP (& I don't know why you would, but).........you are getting a mish-mash of different species, & you're not really sure what you will wind up with.

THOSE WHO REFUSE KNOWLEDGE ARE DOOMED TO FAIL.

WATER CHANGES ARE THE LIFEBLOOD OF THIS HOBBY. IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE SO OR SIMPLY DON'T FEEL LIKE DOING THEM, RE-HOME YOUR FISH, SELL YOUR AQUARIUM & FIND ANOTHER HOBBY, AS YOU WILL FAIL UTTERLY, COMPLETELY, & MISERABLY.
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Lammergeier replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

Ah, I see. Should have figured it'd be all about the $$$. I've seen FHs for sale down here for $300 - $400. Boggles my mind.

Pfft, what an idiot.

I don't like FHs much, but I can kinda understand why inexperienced people (or people that just don't care about preserving species and want a colourful fish) might go for some of them - at least, the ones without those abominable kok things. Ugh. I think any real species of cichlid looks better though. Even if they're colourful, flowerhorns just look 'off' to me.

My primary reason for disliking them is the damage I think breeding (and keeping them) has done for conservation of rarer cichlid species, and even just species preservation in the hobby in general (I want a trimac but they've been chased out of the market by giant 'kok' heads, damn it!).

BPs, though, I will never, ever understand. The poor things are just pitiable, and I really don't understand at all why they've been bred into existence in the first place. What was the thought process? "Yeah! let's selectively breed a fish that has a deformed spine and mouth. Great idea. Oh, the males are sterile? That's fine. Look, the fish can barely eat and looks like its eyes are going to pop out of its head. Perfectly reasonable!"
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  • ehall67
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ehall67 replied the topic: Henry and Adie Sitting in a Tree...

There is no chance of hybrids ever being in our club! We would never condone them.

From the ACA they were toying around with the idea of allowing some hybrids to the event for the reason to educate the public about them and how they are completely separate from what we do as fish keepers and also so they have a place to go and people do not try to fit hybrids into shows or anything like that.

hybrids have the ability to ruin so many fragile blood lines. we should be preserving nature not playing Dr Frankenstein.

The biggest problem come in selling hybrid fish and them breeding with pure breeds. and then selling them off as something different. That is why I only buy fish from reputable dealers and from auctions when I know who's the breed is. I mean I have bought fish I like without knowing the breeder but I either don't breed them or wait till they grow out and can make sure they are what they are supposed to be.

I just feel there are so many beautiful fish out there there is no need to cross them. And also there is such a risk of fish being crossed by inexperienced fish keepers and proliferating more hybrids

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